Really cool to see my favs show up, but I honestly don't understand what we're actually looking at; the groupings seem very opaque beyond very general themes like sci-fi, startups, biographies, math, physics.
In other words, what are the clustering shapes telling us? Can we dig in based on geography, publishing date, key terms or themes?
Either way, I can't keep the site open for more than 30-40 seconds before it crashes. I suspect that's not the goal!
Is Cryptonomicon the best fiction book, or is the data wrong?
There's a sort of regular repeating confusion with embeddings that they're very well behaved in visual dimensions.
IMHO it's a category error that results from tutorials using the king + female = queen example (which, funnily enough, wasn't even true for the original word2vec, if commentary I've read previously here is correct).
Working with them a lot has me picture them more as "a multivariate function that outputs 768 numbers, and was learned by brute force" than "something that sees in 768 dimensions" --- of course, they're both true, but the second interpretation shades more than it illuminates once you're past the very first interrogatory of "so what is this calculating, exactly?"
How behaved they are visually depends on what drives variance and what you’re hoping to see. There are certainly some nice properties in some dimensionality reductions, but if you flatten a space of faces it’s less likely that you’ll get the property of “brown hair” as a query embedded in any visually interesting way than actually putting in a face as a query.
More clearly, symmetric retrieval is easier to visualize in a dimensionality reduced space than asymmetric retrieval.
I suspect that some form of multi vector document embedding would be more understandable in the reduced space than this single vector representation.
The crash was indeed not intended - my mistake! Should be fixed now.
You've got the cluster semantics spot on, to be honest. Broad genres are grouped together, with a tendency for sub-genres to be grouped locally within those.
There is no interpretation of the overall shapes or the global structure, those are more a result of a particular UMAP run than inherent in the data.
Would love to provide different views on it and go more in depth next, thanks for the suggestion.
Failed to load module script: Expected a JavaScript module script but the server responded with a MIME type of "text/html". Strict MIME type checking is enforced for module scripts per HTML spec.
Ad infinitum for a list of a couple .js files with repeating names.
Guess we'll have to come back in a day or two to experience it in it's full glory :).
Hey, thanks for reporting - this is fixed now. I messed up the static build and some browsers freaked out. By law of showing things publicly, I of course only tested in a browser that didn't. Hope you can give it another chance!
Related, I did some book detection of hackernews comments using chatgpt 3.5 at [1]. Didn't do any fancy visualisation like this, but just a table of the most recommended books.
Niiice! I really like it. The spatial approach is cool, though labelling/annotations/axes would help.
I share the frustraion with getting book covers for my project ablf.io. Amazon used to make this much easier, but they've locked it down recently, so you have to jump through affiliate hoops. I ended up implementing my own thing and storing thousands of images myself on S3. If you have the goodreads IDs, feel free to use:
assets.abooklike.foo/covers/{goodreads id}.jpg
N.B. The actual goodreads website itself make it hard as well since they have an additional UUID in their img URIs, so it's not deterministic; that's why I created this.
Nice site! I like that I can filter results by fiction or non-fiction. Interesting to enter my favourite novels and see the non-fiction that's recommended. Some surprisingly good picks!
Adding direct links to the comments that mention the books could be a good feature to add. Hacker News Books [1] does this and it's useful have all the comments for a book in a single page.
Really cool! Never thought "I Am That" based on the conversations with Nisargdatta Maharaj would show up here. That's the beauty of HN. You never know what you're gonna get :)
Tastefully made. I'm gonna go over it in my leisure time.
About your question for a reliable source to get book covers. I run this api that could possibly do this if you collect the Amazon asin numbers (or urls) for the books (that can also be done with the search api I host): https://docs.unwrangle.com/amazon-product-data-api/
If it seems useful, you can reach out to me and mention this chat. I'll be happy to offer free credits for your project.
The aesthetics are nice, but what I really want is a toggleable overlay that shows the rough keyword mapping for all the books. The single book view is fine for understanding a single book, but not useful for trying to process the whole page to find one book I might want to read.
I also would love to hear more about the cluster shapes and cardinality of the coordinate system. I consider myself am pretty versed in data analysis, however with less expertise on NLP topics (eg t-SNE).
So a quick blurb like: the units on the axes in the graph are “a reduced embedding space” designed to keep structure and to reduce the dimensionality such that the clusters could be plotted on screen…
(I’m not even sure that’s correct, but I would have loved for you to have informed me on the one sentence visualization choice and then point me to t-SNE.)
Overall nice project - and it reminds me of a painful professional analysis lesson I have had to re-learn more than once.
> After working for NN hours on an analysis, and finally breaking through and completing it, overlooking the title and labels is the biggest footgun I have ever dealt with.
Fyi regarding cover images: I have built and run a handful of book related websites and Amazon is the easiest place I found to get book covers. You just need the Amazon id and every image is a standard url.
I find the graphical nature of this to be disorganized and distracting. If you didn’t explain to me what the meaning of the map was it would be essentially a meaningless cluster of book covers.
One small issue on mobile safari. when i tap to drag the map around, if i put my finger down on a book cover to start dragging the map, the book description is immediately expanded. put differently, my intention is to drag not open, but both actions take place when I drag.
I really like the project otherwise. We have a book club that’s deciding on what to read next and this could be very helpful.
Appreciate the work! I didn't find the value of reading until I broke up with my ex which had me rethinking about my whole life and value, that's how I found the value of reading, right now I read when commuting and sometimes I just don't know what to read next, this is a good place to find some good books, thanks!
i'm curious about the decision to use hellinger distance for the second round of UMAP - was that purely empirical or did you have some intuition about why it'd work well for this specific dataset?
also, out of curiosity, what's the most popular book on the map that doesn't have a clear genre cluster?
The cluster memberships that come out of the first round are distributions over the different clusters, e.g. a given book is weighted 0.8 for cluster A and 0.2 for cluster B. The Hellinger distance is well-suited to quantify the difference between two distributions like that. Cosine similarity and Euclidean distance worked as well, but Hellinger gave subjectively nicer results.
Very interesting question, I'm not sure! While developing, I noticed that the systems thinking books were spread over different genres, which I found quite pleasing. However, I'm not sure if other books were even more diffuse. I'll have to dig back in and find out :)
Probably a comment on my subconscious desire for familiarity/patterns, but the left side of the map instantly made me think of NW Europe: long skinny Norway dangling between the UK and Denmark (not correctly spaced, but sizes are reasonably correct!). A few other candidates at a stretch - maybe some Baltic states off to the east, for example - but after that it breaks down unfortunately.
This is great, thanks for sharing! Seems like the perfect fun little project that before LLMs could take some serious data work, but LLMs make pretty trivial to process and create.
I'd like to explore this more, but I'm getting THOUSANDS of errors:
Failed to load module script: Expected a JavaScript module script but the server responded with a MIME type of "text/html". Strict MIME type checking is enforced for module scripts per HTML spec.
My apologies for that! First time deploying Svelte Kit to Cloudflare Pages, and I messed up the static build. Should be fixed now, hope you can give it another shot.
Idea: Amazon has killed 'random' browsing of books. Would love to see this applied to topic area searches etc. so I can have the same serendipity that I used to get in all the bookstores Amazon unalived.
amazing and hilariously accurate. together they represent a culture and shared ontology. having worked in places with others who have read some of these books, the shorthand is super fast.
I think it's useful as a tool for browsing a getting a general gist of what people are into and seeing if your favorites are there, too. As for a tool to maximize one's reading list, certainly not as useful, but I appreciate that it didn't make me feel like I had to create action items on things to read.
OK but there's no clue what they are until you start poking around. It's not something that's useful without some substantial investment of time and exploration. If that's the goal, fine but it's not how I would present a "favorite books" list.
Making 'genres' and classifying things is imprecise and requires experts in subject matter and library science to get it right. The "genre" labels here emerge out of the data itself.
In t-SNE, the distances in the feature vector space are preserved in the projected space. IIRC, these distances serve as boundary conditions to a stochastic diffusion problem. The actual positions and the orientation are allowed to be free variables.
Really cool to see my favs show up, but I honestly don't understand what we're actually looking at; the groupings seem very opaque beyond very general themes like sci-fi, startups, biographies, math, physics.
In other words, what are the clustering shapes telling us? Can we dig in based on geography, publishing date, key terms or themes?
Either way, I can't keep the site open for more than 30-40 seconds before it crashes. I suspect that's not the goal!
Is Cryptonomicon the best fiction book, or is the data wrong?
There's a sort of regular repeating confusion with embeddings that they're very well behaved in visual dimensions.
IMHO it's a category error that results from tutorials using the king + female = queen example (which, funnily enough, wasn't even true for the original word2vec, if commentary I've read previously here is correct).
Working with them a lot has me picture them more as "a multivariate function that outputs 768 numbers, and was learned by brute force" than "something that sees in 768 dimensions" --- of course, they're both true, but the second interpretation shades more than it illuminates once you're past the very first interrogatory of "so what is this calculating, exactly?"
How behaved they are visually depends on what drives variance and what you’re hoping to see. There are certainly some nice properties in some dimensionality reductions, but if you flatten a space of faces it’s less likely that you’ll get the property of “brown hair” as a query embedded in any visually interesting way than actually putting in a face as a query.
More clearly, symmetric retrieval is easier to visualize in a dimensionality reduced space than asymmetric retrieval.
I suspect that some form of multi vector document embedding would be more understandable in the reduced space than this single vector representation.
The crash was indeed not intended - my mistake! Should be fixed now.
You've got the cluster semantics spot on, to be honest. Broad genres are grouped together, with a tendency for sub-genres to be grouped locally within those.
There is no interpretation of the overall shapes or the global structure, those are more a result of a particular UMAP run than inherent in the data.
Would love to provide different views on it and go more in depth next, thanks for the suggestion.
IMO, evolution over time is a great place to start.
> Either way, I can't keep the site open for more than 30-40 seconds before it crashes.
Yup, probably was about to happen to me too, had I not closed it.
CPU fan almost launched off the troposphere about 30 seconds in.
Probably a cluttered bunch of heavily unoptimized ReactJS modules in there (no offense to OP, I know it probably sped up development by 10x at least)
Nope, hug of death is seems:
Failed to load module script: Expected a JavaScript module script but the server responded with a MIME type of "text/html". Strict MIME type checking is enforced for module scripts per HTML spec.
Ad infinitum for a list of a couple .js files with repeating names.
Guess we'll have to come back in a day or two to experience it in it's full glory :).
Hey, thanks for reporting - this is fixed now. I messed up the static build and some browsers freaked out. By law of showing things publicly, I of course only tested in a browser that didn't. Hope you can give it another chance!
Related, I did some book detection of hackernews comments using chatgpt 3.5 at [1]. Didn't do any fancy visualisation like this, but just a table of the most recommended books.
[1] https://blog.reyem.dev/post/extracting_hn_book_recommendatio...
I prefer this a lot more. I think op had a cool idea, but the implementation could use a little work.
Niiice! I really like it. The spatial approach is cool, though labelling/annotations/axes would help.
I share the frustraion with getting book covers for my project ablf.io. Amazon used to make this much easier, but they've locked it down recently, so you have to jump through affiliate hoops. I ended up implementing my own thing and storing thousands of images myself on S3. If you have the goodreads IDs, feel free to use:
N.B. The actual goodreads website itself make it hard as well since they have an additional UUID in their img URIs, so it's not deterministic; that's why I created this.That’s a great website. I’ve been looking for alternative book recommendation websites for a while and it really has nailed it down.
It even recommended me a somewhat eclectic book I’ve recently been meaning to read.
Is there a reason you limit to only 6 favorite books? Is it due to computational restraints?
Nice site! I like that I can filter results by fiction or non-fiction. Interesting to enter my favourite novels and see the non-fiction that's recommended. Some surprisingly good picks!
Congrats! The interface is beautiful and fast!
Adding direct links to the comments that mention the books could be a good feature to add. Hacker News Books [1] does this and it's useful have all the comments for a book in a single page.
1. https://hackernewsbooks.com
Check out the OpenLibrary Covers API: https://openlibrary.org/dev/docs/api/covers
Really cool! Never thought "I Am That" based on the conversations with Nisargdatta Maharaj would show up here. That's the beauty of HN. You never know what you're gonna get :)
Tastefully made. I'm gonna go over it in my leisure time.
About your question for a reliable source to get book covers. I run this api that could possibly do this if you collect the Amazon asin numbers (or urls) for the books (that can also be done with the search api I host): https://docs.unwrangle.com/amazon-product-data-api/
If it seems useful, you can reach out to me and mention this chat. I'll be happy to offer free credits for your project.
The aesthetics are nice, but what I really want is a toggleable overlay that shows the rough keyword mapping for all the books. The single book view is fine for understanding a single book, but not useful for trying to process the whole page to find one book I might want to read.
Nice project though, I love it.
Nice project.
I also would love to hear more about the cluster shapes and cardinality of the coordinate system. I consider myself am pretty versed in data analysis, however with less expertise on NLP topics (eg t-SNE).
So a quick blurb like: the units on the axes in the graph are “a reduced embedding space” designed to keep structure and to reduce the dimensionality such that the clusters could be plotted on screen…
(I’m not even sure that’s correct, but I would have loved for you to have informed me on the one sentence visualization choice and then point me to t-SNE.)
Overall nice project - and it reminds me of a painful professional analysis lesson I have had to re-learn more than once.
> After working for NN hours on an analysis, and finally breaking through and completing it, overlooking the title and labels is the biggest footgun I have ever dealt with.
This is awesome. Can I please request a way to have a list or a tabular format?
I've put a title/author list on a github page here, sorted by title alphabetically
https://github.com/BrianVia/hacker-news-favorite-books
https://hnbooks.pieterma.es/features.geojson
Fyi regarding cover images: I have built and run a handful of book related websites and Amazon is the easiest place I found to get book covers. You just need the Amazon id and every image is a standard url.
Fully agree with this. We built this LLM based book summary app: https://www.booksummary.pro/
The links here directly refer to images on Amazon (e.g. https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81YkqyaFVEL._SL1500_.jpg)
I find the graphical nature of this to be disorganized and distracting. If you didn’t explain to me what the meaning of the map was it would be essentially a meaningless cluster of book covers.
FYI I have a runaway recursive processing when I load the site... it goes down in ~30 seconds or so.
One small issue on mobile safari. when i tap to drag the map around, if i put my finger down on a book cover to start dragging the map, the book description is immediately expanded. put differently, my intention is to drag not open, but both actions take place when I drag.
I really like the project otherwise. We have a book club that’s deciding on what to read next and this could be very helpful.
Appreciate the work! I didn't find the value of reading until I broke up with my ex which had me rethinking about my whole life and value, that's how I found the value of reading, right now I read when commuting and sometimes I just don't know what to read next, this is a good place to find some good books, thanks!
nice project, pieterma.
i'm curious about the decision to use hellinger distance for the second round of UMAP - was that purely empirical or did you have some intuition about why it'd work well for this specific dataset?
also, out of curiosity, what's the most popular book on the map that doesn't have a clear genre cluster?
Thanks!
The cluster memberships that come out of the first round are distributions over the different clusters, e.g. a given book is weighted 0.8 for cluster A and 0.2 for cluster B. The Hellinger distance is well-suited to quantify the difference between two distributions like that. Cosine similarity and Euclidean distance worked as well, but Hellinger gave subjectively nicer results.
Very interesting question, I'm not sure! While developing, I noticed that the systems thinking books were spread over different genres, which I found quite pleasing. However, I'm not sure if other books were even more diffuse. I'll have to dig back in and find out :)
This is awesome! Do you mind if I add this list to my books site? (https://thegreatestbooks.org) I'll give you full credit and link back to your site.
This is awesome. Glad to see both A Fire Upon the Deep and Deepness made it on the list!
Lovely work, thank you for sharing
Probably a comment on my subconscious desire for familiarity/patterns, but the left side of the map instantly made me think of NW Europe: long skinny Norway dangling between the UK and Denmark (not correctly spaced, but sizes are reasonably correct!). A few other candidates at a stretch - maybe some Baltic states off to the east, for example - but after that it breaks down unfortunately.
Cool project sir
This is great, thanks for sharing! Seems like the perfect fun little project that before LLMs could take some serious data work, but LLMs make pretty trivial to process and create.
I'd like to explore this more, but I'm getting THOUSANDS of errors:
Failed to load module script: Expected a JavaScript module script but the server responded with a MIME type of "text/html". Strict MIME type checking is enforced for module scripts per HTML spec.
This crashes my browser in less than a minute.
My apologies for that! First time deploying Svelte Kit to Cloudflare Pages, and I messed up the static build. Should be fixed now, hope you can give it another shot.
Love this. I like that the clustering allows me to start from a book I've read and liked, and then move on the similar books in the cluster.
For example, I just finished The Phoenix Project.
I'm already seeing some related books I should take a look at.
Very useful!
This is cool.
Idea: Amazon has killed 'random' browsing of books. Would love to see this applied to topic area searches etc. so I can have the same serendipity that I used to get in all the bookstores Amazon unalived.
Well, for fiction there is:
https://www.literature-map.com/
More on Latent Space Visualization: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_cAOa5fMhE
amazing and hilariously accurate. together they represent a culture and shared ontology. having worked in places with others who have read some of these books, the shorthand is super fast.
For my system: becomes unresponsive within the first second.
* Google Chrome form flathub. Version 128.0.6613.119 (Official Build) (64-bit) * Debian 12 bookworm under KDE Wayland
Should we be concerned that Mein Kampf shows up in a list of HN "favorite books"?
Any way to determine the quantity of recommendations or degree of positive sentiment? Maybe a larger book cover image?
Interesting but the visualization is useless. How about a standard tabular format maybe grouped by genre?
I think it's useful as a tool for browsing a getting a general gist of what people are into and seeing if your favorites are there, too. As for a tool to maximize one's reading list, certainly not as useful, but I appreciate that it didn't make me feel like I had to create action items on things to read.
The 'genres' emerge out of the clusters. The fact that you can pick out 'genres' from this plot is an example of semi-supervised learning.
OK but there's no clue what they are until you start poking around. It's not something that's useful without some substantial investment of time and exploration. If that's the goal, fine but it's not how I would present a "favorite books" list.
Making 'genres' and classifying things is imprecise and requires experts in subject matter and library science to get it right. The "genre" labels here emerge out of the data itself.
Is there a way to see cluster names?
Nice, super responsive - what's this using underneath? I see canvas + svelte
Did this project cost you anything to complete?
Did you reduce the dimension before applying HDBSCAN?
I did, there was a first round of UMAP to 50 dimensions. Running HDBSCAN on the full embeddings gave bad results, lots of singleton clusters.
Very nice. Do you have a text format of this available?
Well, now I have recommendations; ty! I just bought 9 books from this list, filling in around ones I know I like. This is outstanding.
I'm not sure I understand the "map" part of this. What does the geography represent exactly?
looks like t-SNE projection
What does each axis represent?
What is the significance of the placement of each cluster?
In t-SNE, the distances in the feature vector space are preserved in the projected space. IIRC, these distances serve as boundary conditions to a stochastic diffusion problem. The actual positions and the orientation are allowed to be free variables.
this is great, and cool looking, thanks!